LEAVE THE POPE ALONE!!!
Yes. I say leave him alone. Can't you believe me?! Why?!
We should find an excuse for him for what he said. So, I found out that he is POOR IGNORANT PERSON!!!
He has no idea what is Islam ,,, what is real Islam stands for. He knows nothing about Islam teachings and I feel really really sorry for him.
This new pope hasn't that lovely charisma of old pope. Old pope (Pope John Paul II) was so special and I liked him so much. I told my Christian friends about that long time before and I told them "frankly" that I liked the old pope, but I don't like the new one. So, now I can be sure about that!. (Oh, yes, it wasn't good to judge someone by his Look, but sometimes some people give you uncomfortable impression even with their Looks only)
He needs to have very intensive courses to learn more about Islam and other religions too,, to know more about History and who really used and still uses religions for his illusive HOLY WAR.
Man in his position needs to balance his words and his speeches,, needs to appear appropriately.
Q: If the Pope is ignorant like that, how can we blame ordinary and simple people????!!!!!
My Father taught me to balance my words and taught me that tongue can be the worst part of human's body if he let it control him wrongly. My father, as a simple man, taught me to respect all people, no matter who and consider the old ones as my parents and who's in my age or younger as my siblings. This is what my father wants me to be. So, how about person can we consider him as symbol for most of Christians??!!!
Anyway, I really didn't care about what he said or says and I think we should ignore him.
He should learn to listen more and speak less. Good advice for him and for all of us. But God, someone should help him to know more about other religions and about history!
No No No, I'm busy right now!! :D
Oh, as some of us say here, IF YOU ARE REAL MAN WITH REAL PRINCIPLES, you should criticize what Zionists did, what Bush Gang did and what they and many others still do. Their own HOLY WARS are still going on without any clear signs to stop!
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Here you are what Holy Quran Says:
وَعِبَادُ الرَّحْمَنِ الَّذِينَ يَمْشُونَ عَلَى الْأَرْضِ هَوْنًا وَإِذَا خَاطَبَهُمُ الْجَاهِلُونَ قَالُوا سَلَامًا))
((The (faithful) worshippers of the Beneficent are they who walk upon the earth modestly, and when the ignorant ones address them answer: Peace)) 25:63
(ادْعُ إِلِى سَبِيلِ رَبِّكَ بِالْحِكْمَةِ وَالْمَوْعِظَةِ الْحَسَنَةِ وَجَادِلْهُم بِالَّتِي هِيَ أَحْسَنُ إِنَّ رَبَّكَ هُوَ أَعْلَمُ بِمَن ضَلَّ عَن سَبِيلِهِ وَهُوَ أَعْلَمُ بِالْمُهْتَدِينَ)
((Call unto the way of thy Lord with wisdom and fair exhortation, and reason with them in the better way. thy Lord is best aware of him who strayeth from His way, and He is Best Aware of those who go aright.)) 16:125
~ May Peace Of God Be On You~
:::UPADTE:::
The pope words didn't hurt me as much as some stupid reactions of some Muslims. I really hate to see such reactions like that and not represent us, as moderate Muslims and real tolerant Islam. Please brothers and sisters,, don't hurt Islam again by yourselves….if pope or any person hurts Islam with unenlightenment…we can understand that he or she knows nothing to judge in right way, but how can we fix his unsound view about Islam with such ugly reactions?!!
**************************************************************
God Bless Dear Sister Karin and Her Words Of Wisdom.
Read Her Statement about this Topic:
ISLAM IS A RELIGION OF PEACE!
posted by Noor Al-Amal at 11:03 AM
18 Comments:
Noor dear. You might want to delete this post so that you do not appear to be as ignorant as you are blaming the Pope to be. He was quoting another person's words and that was a very small part of his speech. Did you even bother to read his speech? Or are you just jumping to conclusions and speaking your gut feelings before getting the knowledge? I know that you cannot deny that there are people that use the prophet's words to justify killing.
Noor, dear friend - I did a lot of research yesterday (till 02:00!!) before I wrote my post - as well of the pope's fauxpas and found, what he did was QUOTE the last byzantine Emperor Manuel II Paleologus, talking to a Persian scholar in 1391. That was what happened. So I can NOT imply, it is HIS opinion of Islam what this terrible quote said. Ok ... that is ONE aspect!
The OTHER - and with this one I do wholeheartedly agree with you - it was MOST insensitive and careless to chose a quote which he must have known, would hurt the feelings of Muslims worldwide! He is a TOP-intelligent person and the head of the Catholic church - and as such I do expect more sensitivity and diplomacy! I really can't understand why he did that, why he chose this quote - it is beyond me! I give him the credit to NOT have aimed for any insult in ANY way - he is not a person who would do that. I do think as well he MIGHT feel more comfortable with Christianity and as well Judaism because of the same books (Old and NEW Testament). That does mean, he needs a MAJOR lesson in Islam to understand what it REALLY stands for, what it REALLY represents! I can only thank my wonderful blogger-friends for having taught me - today I KNOW ... and pass that on without hesitation!
Islam had temporarily it's dark side and Christianity by GOD as well ... so I don't feel one should swoop down on the other in any way - BOTH made mistakes and (hopefully) learned .. though sometimes I have severe doubts on that ...
Thanks dear - I alwyays highly appreciate your opinion! This time we clarified TOGETHER what really happened ... and analysed it in order to find what needs to be done. As we did it TOGETHER - I feel very good about it!!
LUV YA!! :)
the question is who is next and what is the next to come against Islam,
first the Cartoons and now the pope!
I add link to you post here
http://atlascenter.blogspot.com/2006/09/no-coercion-in-islam.html
thanks Dear Noor
Coming from protestant Christian background (and having freed my mind of most of it) I'm glad the pope doesn't speak for me.
I appreciate your balanced wiev: let's not jump the gun. What worries me are so many Muslims out there who go ballistic at the slightest chance. So what if the pope makes an unappropriate quote ? Does that justify death threats ?
adam: believe it or not. The cartoons and the pope are not part of a conspiracy.
Dear Noor.
I fear this pope a lot! I do think he really knew what he was saying or doing because he does have a very good knowledge about religions. Also he worked as prefect of congregation for the doctrine of the faith, what was intrinsically related to inquisition! I blog today about it and I think that the pope could be preoccupied with his memory… how a former prefect of CDF could forget about the Crusades?
Anyway… we, you and me, were blessed for having have wise fathers as we did!
Aha. Sweetie UH, thank you dear and be sure that I will never ever delete any post (I did that once and just for very dear friend of mine). Now, I read and I watched what our dear pope said and I know that he Quoted, but did that was wise and right quoting?! Man in his place should open doors and cools the air to make people very close and remove any apparent differences, but he seems have another plans!
I didn't say that no one use religions in their own ways to achieve weird plans and things we don't have. Even Christians and Jews did this and still have their "illusionary" holy wars and waiting for Jesus to guide them to heaven after they kill unbelievers.
As if I'm ignorant, yes I am , my dear sister. No one born with all knowledge of this world in his head, only step by step we gained knowledge and knew things. Despite that, we will still learn new things and never stop learning.
My beloved sister Karin. Thank you so much for lighting the road and that was my point. He did wrong by that quoting and he chose wrong words. If he really know Islam and what is the Islam teachings, beside Islam history, he will never use any misled historical events.
Anyway, I wasn't mad at all. I just smiled when I watched the news that day. U know sometimes, when u expect something and that will never surprise u. I only didn't like what some Muslims did. I just write my opinion her and I really and deeply what him to learn more about REAL ISLAM and not give his judge through fallible humans.
I love U too my Dear :)
Adam: I only want Muslims to deal with that with more tolerant and answer with more reasonable and wise ways. That what Islam and Quran asking us to do and deal with. See, I chose these 2 verses to show how Islam wants us to deal with who can't the level of understanding!
Thank u for adding my post to urs. It's a big honor.
Halalhippie : protestant :) Later .,,,
yes, I hated what some Muslims said and did. Their reactions was too bad and not reflect us truly.
Dear living away. I just think he chose his words wrongly. He should be a massager of peace and love, not make more gaps. Person in his place should be careful with his words. all people listen to him as a saint now.
Thank you dear. Yes, we are blessed with our families.
"all people listen to him as a saint now?"
ALL? Do you? I don't. I'm sure that all those atheists don't. The protestant Christians don't. I really would find it hard to believe that the Bhuddists or the Confusists do.
You said: "Even Christians and Jews did this and still have their "illusionary" holy wars and waiting for Jesus to guide them to heaven after they kill unbelievers"
That sure is scary. I'm glad I've never come across any of those people.
Keep reading and learning and in the meantine, remember to LOVE all of God's creations and pray for their enlightenment.
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I won't mention Pope Urban the II, because then that would just make all Muslims look bad and show the Catholic Church for was it is, an outdated politics of the past.
I'm not here to judge, but same old same old. No new ideas on either side... Christian nor Muslim. Makes you wonder how the Buddhists have lived in peace for so many centuries when niether Christianity nor Islam has succeeded at.
Maybe that Buddha guy was onto something. The true path? Hmmm... how about the path with no killing for the sake of killing in the name of God. A religion which respects nature, ancestors, parents, and other human beings, a desire for peace and harmony among all living things? A religion which envokes the responsibility to be disciplined and do the right thing? A religion to give you a purpose and a sense of being? A practical religion which has been the ONLY religion acknowledge to make human society more peaceful? Holy-can't believe it's not butter Batman! That must be some made up fake religion.
Oh, there's that word again. "Religion." Hmmm... it means something, I think. Hmmphf! Whatever.
Tristan: religions seem to start out w/the best intentions, and then the followers mess things up.
"No one born with all knowledge of this world in his head, only step by step we gained knowledge and knew things. Despite that, we will still learn new things and never stop learning."
Ur so right Noor, we could start respecting each other as humans, and then maybe try to understand each other's beliefs.
Calling each other names doesn't do any good - and I'm not thinking about the pope here, more about the imams calling "us" pigs, apes and infidels. It happens every friday. It hurts and worries me, but should I take to the street and riot? What good would it do ?
I wish the clerics would put more energy into bringing people closer to God and not farther from each other.
Bless y'all
I see that this is becoming a heated debate.
I consider myself a devout Muslim but just like Noor and Leandra (living away), I had a wise father, who, in the middle of the religious struggle in Lebanon, succeeded in separating me and my siblings from extremism.
I do not believe that the Pope didnt mean anything. and just like Karin ( I love Munich) It just beats me how he would say something like that. Even the whole Quote is out of place. It is just not right.
I add my voice to yours, Noor, to condemn all the violence done by some Muslims in reaction to what the pope said; it doesnt help at all. Not to mention it is Haram. I also like the Last pope (John Paull II) much better.
To Tristan Vick, I say that I heard once that Japanese Kamikaze, during the world war II were mostly Buddhists. Brain washed do die for the country or God or whatever; point being that even the "most peaceful of religions" could be interpreted wrongly and used in violent ways.
anyway, being from a multicultural, multi-religious part of the world, I hope this thing would pass peacefully. But with a Pope that can not apologize and an ever-angry riots, I can not see a way out.
From Iraqthemodel blog:
"First of all, we need to review these texts and history books that Muslim scholars insist on relying on, and before they judge others' knowledge they must present what proves the opposite of the stories or facts they reject. Or, they should abandon these texts and declare them invalid.
Now let's see, the chief cleric of the al-Azhar university accused the pope of ignorance about Islamic history, right? Let's hear what another history scholar from al-Azhar said in one of his books about the same stage of Islamic history as the one the pope was referring to.
Sheikh Khaleel Abdul Kareem in his book "Shadu al-Rababa fi Ahwal al-Sahaba" (first edition 1997) said:
"Did the invaded people take the belief of the invaders voluntarily? What were they expected to do after seeing with their own eyes their men being slaughtered even after they surrendered and raised the white flag? Or when they saw their houses burned down, women taken slaves, belongings purged and taxes imposed, where they expected to keep their religion or move to embrace that of their invading masters to get away from the punishment?" "
Ha-ha. Sorry I made a funny mistake up there. I meant to say "messenger" not "massager". Sorry, that what happen when I write in hurry.
UH: I meant that his words and opinions effect and he has real power to build or destroy. Yes, I listen to his speech if it's good or bad, if it's help or not,, but honestly not a saint to me. But, u said "I don't",, this can be a new hint to find out who u r and that somehow confirms my expectation.
Anyway, All of them (Christians of all denominations, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Freemasons, Atheists, etc) will listen and react if the pope mention them somehow in his speeches. Therefore, some look at him as a saint and some look at him as an effective person.
When I said that, I meant some of them like Crusades leader,, Mr Bush and his Gang or like butchers aka Zionists in Israel. These who are really scary and have their own weird imaginary of God has order them to lead the world.
Finally, u said good thing and reach the point UH,,, that what islam ask people to do: LOVE all of God's creations and never hurt any!!
I hope all of us will be enlightenment through GOD'S LIGHTS!
Thank u so much and have a wonderful day!
Tristan: I don't know who is Pope Urban the II and what he said and I don't care honestly. I don't know why Muslims reacted like that. Not a big deal. Does ocean change If someone threw a small stone into it?!,,,,
Islam looks like fruitful Palm Tree, throw it with stones and its throw you Yummy Dates :)
Buddhists are like monks. Isolate themselves from people and not interactive with world. They are living in their own world. While Islam is a way of life. Islam asks us to deal with people, be nice and polite, be gentle with all people even who hurt us. Unfortunately, some Muslims couldn’t see this face of Islam, the tolerance of Islam, they are still humans and fallible humans.
(((A man used to offend prophet Mohammed every day and put rubbish and dirt in his front door,, every day prophet used to go out and clean his front door with big tolerance and never said bad things to that man. He never did the same. One day, prophet didn't find dirt and trash in his front door. He got worried about that man and went to ask about him and what happened to him. The man was sick and prophet went to see him. The man cried and felt sorry for what he did to prophet while prophet comforted him by saying: it's okay. however, the man embraced Islam before he die.)))
Islam never excuse killing for killing. See what dear Karin chose in her post.
For long time, I had no purposes and no clear goals in my life. I never thought about life and what after life. Islam gave me clear and pure goals to do. To be nice and help others,, all people no matter their religion is for the sake of Allah. Never waiting for a reward from humans as long as God Love and Mercy covering me. This is the ultimate reward I can get.
Oh, dear Halal Hippie. I'm really sorry for what some ignorant imams do. Some people blinded with anger. I even watched a report in Islam Channel News about visit of parliamentary to Muslims in UK. I noticed 2 behaviors of some anti-this parliamentary. Some politely talked to media about their worries and disagreements with this guy, the other one hurt me with this loud yelling and rude style. I don't like people who do such thing. We can let others know our views with nice and polite attitude "as Islam asks us to be".
The role of clerics is really big and effective. Hope really to play it rightly.
Hamze: wonderful example really. U can write about that. Good point to show the role of families and leading people to guide others in right path or wrong path.
Kamikaze!! New thing added to me. I never knew about that. So bad and sad too. U r right brain washed can go so far to let people die for anything.
Um Haleema: Sorry. I can't get it indeed. If u meant that Islam spread by sword. I'm telling you that there are counties and people embraced Islam voluntarily. Some when they dealt with True Muslims merchants. Crusades killed all people when they reached Jerusalem no matters Muslims, Jews or Christians. When Muslims left Andalusia,, Jews followed them because they were safe under Muslims rule while they couldn't trust who came later.
This kind of history I really like. The history of glory Muslims and Islam. They real Muslims who help and save who need them.
"This kind of history I really like. The history of glory Muslims and Islam. They real Muslims who help and save who need them."
Noor, we can't ignore the history that we don't like. To do that creates the problems that we have. Such as those of us who get upset when someone relates this history so they proceed to defame, threaten or even KILL because they were either never taught the true history or they chose to overlook it. Can you understand what I am saying?
Do you know the history of what started the Crusades? That is important to know.
You said: "But, u said "I don't",, this can be a new hint to find out who u r and that somehow confirms my expectation"
Once again, when you say "who I am"
are you speaking of my religion once again? Do you wish to judge people based on their religious beliefs? Do you want to be judged based on your religious beliefs? Are you nothing BUT your religious beliefs or are you more than that? If you had NO religious beliefs would you cease to be a human being? That is very sad if that is the case.
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Most Kamikaze were Shinto, not Buddhist.
But the ones that were Buddhist were not doing the killing because they were Buddhist, they were fighting because they were in a little war called...
WORLD WAR II. Oh yeah, the biggest war the entire world has ever fought. But that's besides the point. Kamikaze is a cultural form of sacrifice related to some of the ancient Japanese cultural customs of the warrior code stemming from the Samurai. Because the Imperial military was able to turn this into a type of war propoganda doesn't have anything to do with the beliefs of Buddhism, or the religion itself.
Oh, sorry, I didn't see ur comment. Anyway, I meant the history that expresses the real Islam and real Muslims. Some did bad and didn't represent Islam right. Not only in Islamic history, all histories have their own bad and ugly faces, like crusades and what they did to innocent people and colonial powers which tortured native peoples and did horrible things. We can see black pages in all nations' history. However, that should not represent the Real and original essence.
OH dear, u took it all wrong. U just flame my curiosity and I wish to know u more and more. I took little details that can help me to know,, u r from USA for example and so on. Dear, I love people who do right and try to be better humans, while I hate who do opposite no matter the religion is. I hate Muslims who know nothing about Islam and jump to do opposite of Islam teachings, I hate who make it hard on people to be better and replace their bad sins with new good deeds. So, no, I don't link people with religions,, besides, I loved atheist people who do great and good deeds regardless their beliefs. Take it easy and try to be more flexible. :)
Thank u Tristan.:)
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